Burger buns really sticky

lakelynn

The Summer 2011 Baking Sheet had a buttermilk onion bread that was mixed in the bread machine and then baked. While I have made bread before using a mixer, and also used my Zo bread machine, I've never mixed in the Zo then baked in the oven nor have I ever made rolls. I wanted a more plain roll and turned to KA Baker's Companion page 232 "Beautiful Burger Buns" and followed the recipe. However, when I went to divide the dough for buns it was VERY sticky - stick to your hands wet looking sticky. (almost like that flour water glue you can make) I kneaded in at least 1/4 cup flour - maybe more and formed the rolls and they are now rising. I'm sure I added the 3 1/4 C flour that was called for and used the correct amount of water (1 cup) and egg (1 large). It's a lovely day to bake - not humid so I don't think the weather did it. So, any ideas on what I did wrong??? Your help/suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! Lynn

badge posted by: lakelynn on June 15, 2011 at 1:51 pm in General discussions
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reply by: KAF_MaryJane on June 15, 2011 at 2:19 pm
KAF_MaryJane

Hi Lynn,
It's a lovely day here too, but the weather over the past week or so has been wet, wet, wet. I know my flour is feeling damp right now, so that may be the issue.

reply by: lakelynn on June 15, 2011 at 2:36 pm
lakelynn

So am I to understand that even though it's nice out, all the rain we have had would make the flour damp thus adding moisture and therefore I needed more flour???? EURIKA - sounds good. I'll try this recipe again when it's been dry for several days. Right now the buns are in the oven and look fine...thanks!

reply by: Mike Nolan on June 15, 2011 at 6:58 pm
Mike Nolan

Humidity can affect your flour by a few percent, even if you weight your flour rather than measure it.

You should always be prepared to adjust the dough a little, either by adding some more flour or a little more liquid. Your fingers (and tongue, should you taste your dough like many of us do) will tell you whether it needs adjusting.

I also recommend keeping notes on how the dough looks and feels and how it turned out. Some recipes just need to be a bit moister than others.

reply by: lakelynn on June 16, 2011 at 12:04 pm
lakelynn

Mike, I do put sticky notes all over the recipies I try to note progress. I really wasn't sure how it should "look" though it did appear wet in the Zo. When I tried to form the dough into rolls, I realized just how wet! Well, know I know. I never thought of tasting the dough - I'll give that a try. Lynn

reply by: Mike Nolan on June 16, 2011 at 1:07 pm
Mike Nolan

I've gotten a bit wary of tasting doughs that have raw egg in them, though sometimes I do it anyway.

reply by: MangoChutney - Sandra Too on June 16, 2011 at 1:08 pm
MangoChutney - Sandra Too

What's it supposed to taste like when it is the correct hydration?

reply by: KitchenBarbarian aka Zen on June 16, 2011 at 2:40 pm
KitchenBarbarian aka Zen

Raw dough - YUCK! I'll just go by look/feel, personally, LOL!

reply by: Mike Nolan on June 16, 2011 at 3:32 pm
Mike Nolan

It's more a question of 'mouth feel', and of course the 'correct' hydration is dependent upon the recipe. A high hydration dough will sort of stick to the roof of your mouth, though.

Mostly what I think my mouth tells me is:

1. If I have left an important ingredient out, like salt.
2. If the gluten is sufficiently developed. (I find this a good complement to the windowpane test, especially for doughs with a lot of whole grain flour in them.)

Personally I like the taste of raw dough, but different strokes...

Laugh if you want, but I use all five senses on most bread dough. The 'hearing' part has to do with listening to how it sounds as it kneads in the mixer, both the tone of the motor and the sound the dough makes as it slaps around in the bowl. With some doughs there's a distinct change in tone when the gluten has developed to the level I'm after, and I can hear that from a good 10 feet away.

reply by: MangoChutney - Sandra Too on June 16, 2011 at 6:01 pm
MangoChutney - Sandra Too

I'm less fond of bread dough than I am of cake batter, but it's okay. I'm not shy about tasting it, anyway. There's nothing wrong with using all five senses in cooking, and even a sixth sense if you can develop such a thing.

What's developed gluten like in your mouth? Is it chewy, like bubblegum? I just made a loaf, so I can't experiment with that for another week or so.

reply by: Mike Nolan on June 16, 2011 at 7:34 pm
Mike Nolan

You can feel the change in stretchiness with your tongue as the gluten develops, but it isn't nearly as stretchy as bubble gum. It also has a bit more firmness when you bite it, though not quite a snap to it.

Years ago I managed to double up the salt in a loaf of bread, or possibly more than that because it was a recipe that called for 1.5 teaspoons of salt and 1.5 tablespoons of sugar, and I either got those backwards or measured out salt both times. It was awful, even the birds wouldn't eat it.

That's when I started tasting the dough nearly every time, which was actually something my sister taught me to do 50+ years ago. I have managed to leave the yeast out once, too.

Cake batter tastes great, brownie batter is better and cookie dough is so good they use it as an add-in in ice cream!

reply by: lakelynn on June 18, 2011 at 9:44 am
lakelynn

Well, I do eat cookie dough 'cause it's so good and cake and brownie batter when done mixing just to clean the pan :) I'll now start tasting bread - it's easy to miss something and while I've never over salted, I bet it really did taste BAD!

reply by: frick on June 19, 2011 at 4:38 pm
frick

I'm not fond of raw bread dough but tasting might have helped when I left out the salt (only once, I do learn from my mistakes!) I have never left out the yeast but did once leave the paddles out of the Zo.

reply by: wsmoak on July 02, 2011 at 9:36 pm
wsmoak

Lakelynn, how did your rolls end up?

I tried the 'Beautiful Burger Buns' recipe tonight and it was *really* sticky -- I had to extract myself from the situation, wash my hands, add some extra flour and try again before I got anything resembling bread dough.

Then it didn't rise very well... I seem to have made biscuits instead of rolls. They taste good though!

I'm guessing I ended up kneading it too much. Next time I'll try in the stand mixer and keep track of how long it runs.

-Wendy

reply by: Mike Nolan on July 02, 2011 at 10:46 pm
Mike Nolan

Wendy, I've made that recipe dozens of time, as have lots of others here. I wonder if you mis-measured something or mis-read it.

How do you measure flour?

It is difficult to over-knead bread dough by hand. The windowpane test is a good one to know when to stop kneading, either by hand or by machine.

reply by: annzie on July 03, 2011 at 3:02 pm
annzie

I'm in the middle of making the Beautiful Burger Buns, but with the addition of Cheese Powder (therefore Cheese Burger Buns). My dough was very sticky, also, but with the gradual addition (several times) of flour (maybe 1/4 c each time) the dough finally behaved beautifully. It is rising now. I doubled the recipe, as we will have company for our Burger Cookout tomorrow, and I like to freeze some for future use.

Several people are having Potato Salad for the 4th of July (or other summer picnics). Over the years I've come up with what I and my family think is the best one yet! I cook Red Bliss potatoes, unpeeled and cut to size, until they are just tender, drain them and put them in an ice water bath for a few minutes. The dressing is made of half plain yogurt and half Hellman's mayonnaise, a tablespoon or so of vinaigrette, salt and pepper to taste, and some drained and chopped capers, all blended together until smooth. To the salad bowl I add diced onion and celery, cut up fresh flat-leaf parsley and dill weed, then drain the potatoes, mix them in, and gently mix in the dressing. I purposely haven't added specific amounts of anything, and tastes are different, as well as the number of those at the table. We will have it tomorrow, with the burgers.

I hope you will try this variation, and enjoy it.

reply by: wsmoak on July 03, 2011 at 3:53 pm
wsmoak

I weighed the flour but it's certainly possible I messed up somewhere, we have guests and lots of distractions. Someone was taking a nap or I wouldn't have been doing it by hand! Thanks for the ideas, I'll give it another try. -Wendy

reply by: annzie on July 04, 2011 at 9:31 am
annzie

Postscript: the buns turned out to be the very best ever! I know, I should have photographed them, but didn't. I doubled the recipe, and ended up not with 16, but with 23 (!) nice-sized buns. I'm happy...